Hebrews 12…Whom the Lord Loves, He Chastens
Hebrews 12
1Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,
2Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
3For consider him that endured such contradiction of sinners against himself, lest ye be wearied and faint in your minds.
4Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin.
5And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:
6For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
8But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
9Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?
10For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.
11Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.
12Wherefore lift up the hands which hang down, and the feeble knees;
13And make straight paths for your feet, lest that which is lame be turned out of the way; but let it rather be healed.
14Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:
15Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;
16Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.
17For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.
18For ye are not come unto the mount that might be touched, and that burned with fire, nor unto blackness, and darkness, and tempest,
19And the sound of a trumpet, and the voice of words; which voice they that heard intreated that the word should not be spoken to them any more:
20(For they could not endure that which was commanded, And if so much as a beast touch the mountain, it shall be stoned, or thrust through with a dart:
21And so terrible was the sight, that Moses said, I exceedingly fear and quake:)
22But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
23To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
24And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.
25See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:
26Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven.
27And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.
28Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear:
29For our God is a consuming fire.
Thanks, Kit. I’ve been thinking a lot about this lately. God chastises those He loves.
Kit, and gals, I have a real dilemma, and since y’all know I don’t do well with e-mail(can’t even remember my password anymore, and being almost totally computer illiterate, can’t figure out how to get a new one.lol), if it’s okay with Kit, I’ll ask for any advice here. I’m so torn about what I should do, and to me, it seems like no matter what I do, someone I love is destined to be hurt. Kit, if you don’t want me to post this problem, let me know, it won’t hurt my feelings.
Go ahead…not sure my advice would be any good…but feel free.
Okay, here it goes. My daughter recently confided to me that her 1st cousin, and best friend in the world, lost her virginity. The girl(I’ll call her Ann) just turned 17, so she’s waited longer than most girls her age, I suppose. But – she did NOT use protection, and did it with a boy who was NOT her boyfriend, was drunk at the time at a party, and is now bragging about it to all her friends at school. And – since she already did ‘it’, she has continued to do ‘it’ in the same fashion just described.
My daughter made me promise, before she told me, that I wouldn’t tell my sister, but that was the last thing I expected her to tell me. My first reaction was, ‘poor Ann, she must really regret it.’ But as I said, she says she doesn’t, is telling EVERYBODY, and now lots of boys are calling – and she’s answering.
Appearances are very important to my sister, who is my best friend. She would absolutely die that her daughter gave herself away to just some ‘guy’. But she would cringe that everybody knows about it, too, and that her little girl is getting quite a reputation. She is looking forward to her daughter starting college next year and an unplanned pregnancy would devastate her.
I spoke to my sister yesterday and tried to tactfully suggest that she put her daughter on birth control, but she wouldn’t hear any of it. Instead she began trashing some poor girl who got knocked up in college by a guy that cared nothing for her, and now refuses to support the baby. All I could think of was that her daughter was doing the very same thing and has been lucky so far.
I don’t know if I should tell her or not. If I do,my daughter will be furious and may not confide in me again. If I don’t, and Ann becomes pregnant, or gets VD, I’ll never forgive myself. And if that happenned, and my sister finds out that I knew all the time what I know, she would probably never speak to me again. If Ann were in a first love situation, and being responsible, I would say nothing, but this isn’t the case. The poor choices she is making could affect her whole life in a terrible way, possibly even taking it if she were to contract AIDs. I would want to know if it were my daughter, but I just don’t know what to do. What do you think? Is this a pickle, or what!
PS The sad part is that Ann just had her 1st kiss less than a year ago. I guess she must’ve liked it.lol
Whoah. Still under her parents roof…Whoah. I think you need to ask your daughter why she told you for starters. Maybe she is hoping you will do something about it. Then think about whether she is God’s own or not….if she is then this verses apply…
James 5
19Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
20Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.
1 John 5
15And if we know that he hear us, whatsoever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we desired of him.
16If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.
17All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.
Galations 6
1Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted.
2Bear ye one another’s burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.
I know she is worried about her cousin, especially about her salvation. She is afraid that ‘Ann’ is an unbeliever despite the fact that her mom has raised her in the old time faith.
Although my sister and I are extremely close, we are two very different types of moms. I tend to be very laid back, and probably more liberal than I should be in what I discuss with my daughter. I’ve always tried to be honest whenever she has asked me questions about my own past and experiences. My sister, on the other hand, believes in the deny everything principle. She would never admit to being the party animal she used to be to her daughter. And has been very strict in bringing up her kids. Ironically, she has ended up with the wild daughter, and I’ve ended up with a daughter that is almost prudish.lol
I tried talking to my daughter about the situation last night, and though she agreed that my sister probably should know what her daughter is up to, she became furious when I suggested talking to her about it. I even told her I would leave her name out of it and tell my sister that I just overheard her and Ann’s conversation. But she wouldn’t hear of it and threatened to never tell me anything again if I tell my sis. That my daughter trusts me enough to confide in me, is one of the things I treasure most in our relationship. She has recently fallen in love for the first time, with a young Army officer. I know she will probably be faced with some pretty strong temptations herself, and I want her to feel like she can come to me with any dilemma she may have. I just don’t know what to do. What would you do if it were your sister, Kit?
Funny you should ask. My sister and I actually talked about this on the way to work and both came to the conclusion that we would tell on each others kids. Then we thanked God that neither of us had any kids!!! And came to the conclusion that dogs are so much easier. Can Doodle talk to her?
I love my Doodlebug, but she is a total spaz and coward. I’m know, in her own way, she has probably told Ann to at least protect herself. She once told me that she and Ann have a code of ethics, of sorts, to never talk about subjects they might argue over. Nuts, huh? The only time she broke this code was during last summer revival. Doodle was very worried since Ann is unsaved. So when they made the altar call, she hugged her and, crying, asked her if she wanted to pray. At this point, Ann dissolved into tears too, and bowed for a short time. After getting up, she hurriedly went to fix her make-up, and worried over and over what two other cousins must be thinking of her.(like they’d think she wasn’t cool). Either she isn’t lost,which I doubt, or just has too much pride to pray hard and repent in front of others.
She barely spoke to Doodle for a week or two afterwards. Now Doodle is especially scared to bring up anything that might make Ann upset with her. I do know she talked to her somewhat about it because when I asked her if she’d talked to her about it in the last couple days, she told me this: Ann talked to her 1st kiss and of course told him what she’d been up to.(Why does she feel the need to tell EVERYBODY? My sis would die of embarrassment if she knew) Apparently he is no longer a virgin either. What a surprise!LOL! Doo thinks Ann and he will probably be doing ‘it’ because they immediately made plans to get together now that they’re both experienced. Can you believe that??
Normally, I wouldn’t hesitate to rat her out because I’m so close to my sister. But I love Doodle more, and don’t want her hurt. I suppose I could write some sort of anonomous letter but that’s really not my style. Besides, if I do tell, Ann will probably need me to try and calm her mom down before she confronts her.
I really wish my sister had taken my hints last weekend, I did everything but come right out and tell her. AARRGGGGG! You’re right. Dogs ARE so much easier.LOL!!!
Hi Lisa,
I just read your delima last night and I prayed about it. When girls begin to behave this way, it is not because they are just after some simple fleshly pleasure, it is something deeper. The main reason why young girls behave this way is because either they don’t have a father or their father ignores them or their father shows no affection towards them. If that is not the case, then there is some lack of love in this girl’s life. By the way that she is blabbing to everyone, it is a sure sign that she is desperately seeking attention. Perhaps she could have been molested or something when she was younger. The point here being, is that someone needs to find out what’s going with her.
I have been on the exact same path as her, and I know many other girls who were the same. Once a girl realizes that she is not going to fill the hole in her life by men who will end up just using her, she may get into drugs or drinking to fill the void. It is a really slippery slope and an easy way to end up raped or even worse. I don’t think her salvation is really even relevant at this point, I think someone needs to find out why she is feeling abandoned or hurting. We can’t worry about whether a person is saved or not, because that is the Lord’s call. We especially cannot force conversion. That is a huge mistake that many parents make.
I did not know Jesus at all until about 5 years ago. I had never gone to church, never knew what was in the Bible, none of it. I was a hot mess for 30 years of my life, suicidal, drunk, you name it, I did it. Any Christian who would have run into me would have immediately written me off as “unsalvagable”. Well, the Lord knew me and He kept me and He revealed Himself to me when He chose. Not by anyone’s doing.
Lisa, you need to pray for this girl and find out what is really going on. To me it seems that this girl is hurt, whether you can see it from the outside or not, I am telling you, something is wrong.
Lisa,
I have to agree with Kari. There is something much deeper here. Anyone who seeks this sort of attention is hurting over something big. I have a past not unlike Kari, but for me it was that negative attention was worse than none at all. This acting out, and for me it was not the lack of a Father, it was so many other things but it all adds up to this kid being out of control and getting what she views as love from this boy. I know you want your relationship with your daughter not to suffer. Why not sit down with your daughter and explain that to her, maybe your daughter and you need to talk to Ann, or your Sister together. I don’t know your relationship with Ann or her Mom or they dynamics there, but right now it sounds like you are the praying adult here. Pray and give all of this to God, he will guide you in all of this and help all of you but I just keep thinking I wish an adult would have cared enough about me to step in and help me somehow. Just keep praying, we will too!
I agree B, I often wonder how much differently my life would have been if I had had just one adult in my life who showed me that they cared about me or loved me. We will all pray with you, Lisa, that the Lord gives you clarity in this situation. There is nothing that we as humans can do to help this girl, but if we submit and allow Jesus to speak through us, mountains can be moved!
Thank’s Kari and B for your opinions. I think it really helps to have someone who isn’t so close to the situation let me know how they see it. And I really think you may have hit the nail on the head. Her parents divorced a few years ago, and Ann was extrememly close to her father. She doesn’t get to see him but a couple of times a year now. And since he ended up married to the floozy who caused the divorce, she has to visit with the floozy too.
At home, Ann’s mother puts a lot of pressure on her to be thinner, blonder, and popular. In fact, she will sometimes criticize Ann for not having a date to events like Homecoming. I know she loves her daughter and wants her to be happy, but maybe she is putting too much pressure on Ann.
Another thing that just hit me. The floozy ended up with Ann’s daddy by becoming pregnant. Oh, I hope Ann isn’t trying to do that to get a guy!
I know she is drinking quite a lot too. My sister and I weren’t exactly angels when we were that age either, and it just surprises me that she doesn’t seem to suspect anything.
I’m not sure Doodle realizes the seriousness of what Ann is doing, and how it can hurt her. She tells me that it’s the ‘norm’ for girls to brag to everyone if they are doing it. Maybe it is, and I am just too old to realize it. I keep praying, but haven’t got much of an answer yet. Or maybe y’all’s answers are my answer and I’m too afraid of what will happen if I tell my sister. But I think I am even more afraid of what may happen if I don’t, and I don’t want Ann to hurt and maybe even agonize years from now over the decisions she is making today.
Thanks for listening and please, please, please let me know if you have any more input.